Hi everybody. Here’s another installment of my ongoing long-term project exploring ideas from James Poulos’s great 2021 book, Human Forever: The Digital Politics of Spiritual War.
I decided to put this episode out for everyone, because I really want everyone to hear what James has to say. He has a unique and valuable perspective on implications of digital technology, and how we can win the war to remain human as those technologies take over our world.
If you are not already a Substack paid subscriber, please consider signing up. It’s just $5 per month or $50 per year, and it’s how I put food on the table and kibble in the kitty bowl. Behind the paywall, you’ll find more discussions like this one, and last week’s discussion with former UFC heavyweight champion Josh Barnett, as well as episodes with just me discussing questions and issues that don’t quite make it into the history show.
James Poulos is the editor of American Mind at the Claremont Institute, as well as the Founder and Editorial Director of RETURN at New Founding.
Please check out his book. It is only available on the blockchain, a decision we discuss in the episode, but if crypto is a barrier for you, it’s time to climb over it. It was certainly a barrier for me, but one way or another, whether we like it or not, it’s a technology with which we’re all going to need a basic familiarity in the trials ahead.
The book is available on the blockchain at Canonic.
Many are asking for more info about why crypto represents a potential for salvation from the apocalypse posited here. I can’t provide that info because I don’t really understand it either. So what I’ll do is get James, and maybe Ardian too (founder of Canonic) on to discuss specific questions we all have. I’m also going to get James and John Robb on the same podcast one day soon.
I may be off base saying this DC, but the idea of Bitcoin and cryptocurrency being a potential salvation from the trend towards consolidation of wealth and ultimately servitude for the masses is that it's a form of currency traded and exchanged by the masses themselves.
It's not controlled by governments or corporate banks, but the people themselves who buy and trade with it. A sort of globalized peasant economy of sorts.
As long as such a currency exists, then institutional powers cannot control consumption, trade or wealth exchange among the peasant classes.
In a nutshell, this means that a sort of underground economy can exist no matter what they do. With this in mind, there's always going to be a faction and means of resistance they cannot nuetralize.
A virtual knife at their backs that cannot be removed.
It'll keep them in line. Because it's basically competition they can never get eliminated.
Please do, everything I’ve seen makes my BS, pyramid scheme meter go off and I’d love to read his book but I’m not invested or convinced enough to go through the extra steps.
yup
I’m hijacking the top comment because it seems like a common confusion.
I found an article that James wrote about crypto because I was just as confused as everyone else about the bitcoin monasteries. The way I read it, it is related the way that governments currently pressure payment processors to prevent money from going to certain groups. i.e the Canadian truckers fund and the Kyle Rittenhouse legal fund. Crypto allows for payments without the possibility of it being controlled or stopped due to an ideological bent. it was a term he started using during the podcast without ever defining why it mattered. Maybe I missed it.
https://english.aawsat.com/home/article/3200691/james-poulos/how-bitcoin-can-immunize-america-cancel-culture
big idea that stuck with me is something along the lines that 'the true value of crypto is in people being able to create and value community among themselves'.. this podcast from Tim Ferriss is an excellent overview https://tim.blog/2021/10/28/chris-dixon-naval-ravikant-transcript/
Hard to imagine why you can't understand an idea from the brain of James Poulos......
I'm a bitcoiner - I think many of your fans are, I was shilled your podcast at a conference - and was very pleased to hear James see some of the same potential in Bitcoin that I do. I was therefore extremely confused and deeply disturbed by the fact that he seems to be referring not to Bitcoin (BTC), but to Bitcoin Satoshi Vision (BSV), a scam-coin with a founder who has been in and out of court lamely claiming to be Satoshi Nakamoto (the pseudonymous inventor of Bitcoin) and suing people who disagree.
I say this because canonic.xyz, and the "bitcoin" wallets it is requiring you to download to use it, all run on BSV.
It's clear Darryl doesn't know the difference, and possibly even James is confused on this point (though he really should get this straight because a Bitcoin Monastery which is mining BSV is going to starve), but Ardian has some serious explaining to do if James thinks he's actually getting Bitcoin in exchange for those books.
It is incredibly misleading and irresponsible to conflate Bitcoin with BSV. Especially in the context of a podcast whose listeners are not very familiar with Bitcoin in the first place.
I really enjoyed this one. Poulos occasionally loses me with the run-on apocalyptic commentary, but there's enough here to sink my teeth into to make it worth another listen later this week.
I thought the idea Darryl posited on technology becoming a demonically possessive force for humanity was interesting. I have a slightly different take, but we end up in similar places. I'm of the opinion that short of a spiritual intervention (and I mean that more literally than an acceptance of some cheap neo-gnostic enlightenment), human beings are pretty much all on a trajectory of becoming the worst versions of themselves. Indeed, if there is a Hell, it's filled with such beings. The biblical imagery of flames and physical torment represent something far worse, an eternity of every character flaw and propensity toward evil getting exponentially worse. If my (admittedly bleak) outlook on human nature is anywhere close to accurate, then the real danger isn't that technology would come to possess our thought processes, but that we would give a class of people (or worse, everyone) a form of artificial immortality, and in doing so would bring Hell to earth. It's less the risk of being possessed by a demon and more a danger of becoming a demon yourself. At this point, I'll go on the record in saying that I think Elon Musk's Neuralink pursuit is a really, really bad idea.
Sweet can’t wait!! Still have my fingers crossed for that last Epstein episode though 🤞😅
I'm glad I've listened to enough of Poulos now to realize that I won't be missing out by not buying or reading his book. I've suffered through as much as I can on here and on other podcasts. He's obviously very well-read, and obviously does plenty of thinking, but I am just never going to succumb to sky gods and best-selling works of fiction as my answer to literally anything. Maybe that is what America needs, so good on ya, and let me be the first to wish you good luck. Our current societal trajectory (always subject to modification) is taking us places we've not been, and that scares an Orthodox religious pundit? Hmmm, sounds good to me. Religious tribalism has plenty to answer for, and it's really rich to hear someone propose that as a plan for our future. Hate to be the one to shit on anyone's parade, (I don't actually hate it, that was a lie) but we've done unspeakable harms to each other with our bad old human tendencies for millenia, no matter what tech or religion was in play at the time, so why exactly will it be worse because we are all plumbed in to one another? Poulos's explanation was (and is always) wordy, rambling and mostly incoherent unless you already buy the religious aspects. Maybe it will just be the same ol' shitshow of greed and violence interspersed with great art and culture. Y'know, people shit. I for one am willing to at least remain open to different, and possibly better ways of interacting. Although I very much do not want to get a lecture from my couch about my posture.
I'm in the same seat and while i don't know from which path in life led you to the opinion on religion, i seem to share some of your opinions.
Jonathan Haidt's book on morality was a good read for me and gave me a less opposed stance to religion Andy can see the positive effects of religion. It was also (i think) where he wrote about self isolated communes in USA and the clear difference after (i think 20) years of how many remained- religious based versus ideology based; communities based on religious foundations are way more long-lived/enduring than non religious ones.
So i guess while I'm not so aggressively opposed to religion or flabbergasted that it continues to stay in our future-building. I still think it's have immense flaws. It was in the Warmaster episode previous to this one talked that Christianity have a rough time as it can't prove the core of itself. My experience is the complete opposite- Things like "when you see truth, you recognize it" , "God don't prove himself to any one demanding proof, good don't accept ultimatums" and other flimsy claims runs unchecked by humanity ongoingly.
Doi think there is a god? Not anymore. Could there be a god? Absolutely!
But the amount of arrogance i would have to accept in myself is staggering. Thinking I was born into (which i was) the "right" religion in the time i was born to the parents i had and not be even considering what i was brought up with being 100% wrong should just not be ok to anyone. Search all your life and change opinion 100 fold and it still don't become a good assumption that "now i know what's what". That's what made me less prone to absolute statements of knowledge myself long ago.
For me who grew up in Sweden's first prosperity church: 1. I'm way too angry, about my past, still and i know it and so don't claim it to be a malevolent idea (religion) even if my experience haven't pointed elsewhere. 2. I've heard the talk so often and learned to decipher it well enough from a cynical viewpoint, if not 100% true. 3. I think i grasp what your last sentence means fully about "lecture from my couch about my posture"
It was a disappointment , this third episode to me. Religion was placed where he "should" have placed a strong brick that don't need faith.
It was like looking at Matrix revolution again.
My path did not include indoctrination into organized religion, and I've always (since childhood) been skeptical of anyone providing untestable answers to real problems. Even as a young person I could see the logic leaps, and I could see people around me constantly using those logic leaps to help justify very inhumane and corrupt practices. As an early teen I devoured mainstream news and got to watch snippets of the Troubles in Ireland, and it was often framed as religion vs religion. Clearly much more nuance is involved in such a long-standing conflict, but the religious aspect is a factor. I watched devoutly religious people in my community step on and backstab people to get ahead. I also know many, many people who try very hard to live the life laid down to them in their holy books, only to look around them and see a world that clearly does not operate according to those texts and teachings. The dissonance this creates seems to polarize some people and either make them throw in the towel on their faith entirely, or decide to overtly over-dedicate themselves to piety, including sermonizing on very aspect of life. Mostly, though, I think people cope in the same way they cope with politicians and other leader-figures constantly lying to them. It's the water we all swim in, so one just gets used to the many hypocrisies. As you also said, when we were younger many issues appeared very black and white, and as we age we come to the inescapable realization that we are very complex beings and societies, and there is no easy way to "fix" our many shortcomings. It is entirely possible that we would live in greater harmony if we all dedicated ourselves to Christian, Muslim or even Scientologist principles, but unless we go all the way and remove the profit motive and the compete/compare mentality we will always have many people who speak out of both sides of their mouths. We cannot have mental peace in a world in which there are literal kings and queens who also pretend to live a pious life. Same goes for the money lovers and hoarders. We simply must stop regarding that behaviour as healthy and just. Ironically, most of my ideas for living a more virtuous, cooperative, peaceful life are found in the Bible and other religious texts, so I can't claim they're my own. But I also can't abide the use of those principles to accumulate personal, corporate or national power and wealth, while ignoring the suffering of billions of people. When we are children we are encouraged to share our toys, our lunch and our time, and never be violent. As adults we are encouraged to hoard those things and sell them for profit whenever possible, and violence and war seems acceptable, even to religious people and institutions. Until I see a willing devolution of power away from institutions and symbols (including nation-states) I can't get behind the idea of religion being anything but a minor part of the way forward. Faith I have no problem with. The religious empires, both literal and figurative, need to go.
Wow, and I accused Polous of being wordy. Sorry, if I was an editor there would be no beginning, and no end, only rambling on forever.
Love the episode, a lot of things hit the right spot. I am not sure I understand the Bitcoin monastery as a solution, and the "opening Bitcoin wallet as making effort" part. Criptocurrencies seem like a part of the problem to me if we are talking about new technologies leading into disasters. Can you please elaborate more in the next episode?
Don’t worry, neither do I (even though they’ve been trying to red pill me on it for like two years now)
If that was the only time you've noticed Poulos speak in riddle-circles then you should listen to more of his ramblings. I'm sure in his head he has a plan and a method, but godammed if he can explain it to laypeople.
There were a few, but I thought that it was my lack of attention, since I am listening while working.
By the way, despite my rants about Poulos, I also feel that many of his ideas (maybe not his, but ideas he promotes) hit the right spots. We just come from different parts of town when it comes to a way forward. Maybe I should have led with that, rather than going full smear-job on him.
I think the main flaw with "crypto currency" or anything that supposedly goes around the elites or those that control the levers of power is that they can declare BTC (bitcoin) as the currency of terrorists and try to track via ISPs those that try to conduct "business" using BTC or any cryptocurrency. What will you buy (food, ammo, gas, homes, meds) if you can't "give" them the "money" without depositing it in banks or using the online payment system that will link you and flag your purchase.
What did the truckers in Canada do when people were trying to support them and they were cut off from fuel, food or support.
Crypto is as good as gold but if you can't spend it, you have a problem.
Now as far as "surviving" what's on the horizon.... the question is, are those that are in oppositon to the coming onslaught going to "reform" the "system" or "revolt" against the system.
Reformation leaves the problem of those that will be displaced from power... Revolution destroys everything and there is no way of predicting what will follow other than life will return to "nature" and "the life of man, solitary, poor, nasty, brutish and short."
When the strong attack the weak, the leader of the weak must be destroyed. Because if they aren't they will regain strength and try again. ..... and if the weak are victorious over the strong, the leader of the strong must be destroyed or they will gather strength and continue their attack.
"If an injury has to be done to a man it should be so severe that his vengeance need not be feared."
"Whoever conquers a free town and does not demolish it commits a great error and may expect to be ruined himself."
Niccolo Machiavelli
What coming onslaught? I've got a wife and three little kids and I like to remain positive for our sakes. I'm not a woke type so I generally lean to "this" type of content, however one thing both sides have in common are doomsayers, and I don't find fretting about carnage particularly healthy or even beneficial. Maybe I'm just weak, maybe I'm scared... probably both. But what the hell am I suppose to do?
Can’t change the past.
Can’t predict the future.
Control the “now” and at least be aware of our situation.
That’s all I can do. Try to prepare my kids to think for themselves and try to fight the peer pressures driving them towards anti-humanism.
The most important thing I've done is go back to simple living... be on a budget, create multiple streams of income and become as self reliant as possible... chickens, garden, canning, simple stuff that leads into a better quality of life thats teachable to my kids!
The see it, understand it, and accept that in a world of chaos and disarray... good simple living can be had and maintained
^this 100%. Especially the part about the Canadian truckers. If BitCoin was really the savior it's touted as, they wouldn't let us have it.
don't mean to be rude but after listening to your first two podcasts about this book and the first draft of your review I was intrigued about this book. After listening to the author kind of just ramble on, tossing out "woke" here and there, talking about Jesus in one breath and then calling people mentally ill losers the next (that doesn't seem very Christlike to me) with no coherent point other than mining for bitcoin (hard pass) all I could think of was this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQCU36pkH7c. Its not really fair but it is pretty funny...
No, you are quite fair. I love a lot of DCs work but this episode was just plain silly to me.
A Christian freaked out by the weirdness of the Internet Age, promoting a revolution towards "Dark Ages 2.0 - The Crypto Monestary"...? Lol ok.
Brave to put someone who talks about Christianity like that on here 👌
I really enjoyed the first two episodes, but this was a huge letdown. James uses a lot of words but substantiates none of his claims. The only solution he ever offers is religion, which somehow falls beyond the scrutiny that is extended to other social phenomena. His viewpoint is clearly American, which is fine, but becomes a bit silly when you try to apply it to a clearly world wide phenomenon such as the internet. Do you have any idea how: 'Americanizing the internet', sounds to your international audience?
My main takeaway was: if you take away religion, what is left of his analysis?
I think he would agree that, if you take away religion, very little is left of his analysis.
Literally reloaded this page four minutes after this was posted lol keep up the work Darryl it's getting powerful
After the interview with John Robb and this episode, I'm gonna have to start recommending Martyr Made to friends when they ask for a good horror podcast...
But jokes aside, this podcast is cool as hell, thanks for keeping up with the simultaneous series! This episode made me want to quit paying tributes to the mainstream techno-religion by watching YouTube, and go to church.
So sweet! Thought you bailed on this series. Just got my copy of Human Forever a few days ago. Perfect timing!
Yes please! This series is indescribably good! Thanks DC!
Fire 🔥
Whooooo! Cannot wait to hear this one!
I'm probably a member of a steep minority of your audience, so I thought it might be interesting to add my thoughts. My experience with James' work is exclusively through this series, so I can only speak to my listening of your lens on his writings and this interview, where mostly you just let him talk.
McLuhan's writing and the cyborg dilemma are familiar territory to me. It was interesting to hear James weave them into his cultural/theological argument.
Ultimately I agree with William Gibson; we are ALL cyborgs, fully augmented by technology since the information age. It ended up being more seamless than computer-chips-in-heads...It's the laptop beneath your fingertips, the phone in your hands...not so much trans people. I'm sure there are overlaps and intersections, but I find the stark dichotomy of his expression of the chad/ woke duality pretty disturbing. Either you're a fat, queer, mentally ill wokie or a chad? What serious person speaks this way?
To be clear, I'm not on twitter, reddit or 4 chan.
I'm an art school graduate working as a welder in Detroit. I have listened to everything you've made and continue to follow you for your excellent scholarship, though the recent more multicolored pill discussions you've hosted are less accessible to me. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
James sounds well informed, and like he had a freaky dark stage in middle/ high school (like you?) but I'm not convinced by the arguments he constructs from the source material, at least not in the space of this interview.
Every person who taught me about Marshall McLuhan was queer. They were all great, hard-working, morally upstanding family people and educators. But that was waaaaayyyy outside the halls and lockers of social media. He invokes "humanity" while regurgitating some of the most dehumanizing reductions born on the internet.
Either way I'm here to hear it! It's funny how find yourself agreeing with someone on the concepts from a certain text but can wind up with radically different conclusions.
Thanks for your hard work and for posting so consistently these days.
James uses internet terms for effect in podcasts, when he thinks it will help relate to the audience. He’s fully capable of being a big boy in different settings. I hear you, though. The first two Human Forever episodes weren’t really based on the material in his book. They were just some thoughts his book touched off for me.
"The first two Human Forever episodes weren’t really based on the material in his book. They were just some thoughts his book touched off for me."
Would explain how different the third one was compared. I don't know of him other than from your episodes so i was hearing this episode with some confusion. Gj finishing off the series!
Interesting discussion but I can't help but noting that the author's proposed antidote for the creation of a "woke theocracy" is to create a christian theocracy. No thanks.
I seem to recall part 1, but don’t remember pt. 2. Is it on the site?
Yeah it’s here somewhere
Found it in archives. Pt 3 was a great episode. Buying the book know. Thanks for the mental engagement.
Great episode indeed! 😍
having this issue too, i'll go check archives
and no luck. weird.
So for those (like myself) going through the comments looking for the two other parts and finding this comment:
https://martyrmade.substack.com/p/human-forever-pt-1
https://martyrmade.substack.com/p/human-forever-pt-2
For the most part, this is a fantastic episode. Loads of great discussion about how technology is warping our minds, societies, and future. The swarm, as John Robb describes, is real and dangerous.
I do have a criticism though. The choice of describing Putin as grounded in reality is an increasingly bizarre one. His history of gambling against western incompetence and lack of will arguably paid off in the past. But he is more than happy to distort reality for his own ends, and his own perceptions are distorted at best, given his pre-war speech.
Putin uses the swarm, when he can.
"Russia is reconstructing reality and rewriting history to legitimize itself and undermine others."
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41599-019-0227-8
https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/CPRT-115SPRT28110/html/CPRT-115SPRT28110.htm
https://theconversation.com/vladimir-putins-lying-game-100513
https://www.hindustantimes.com/world-news/putins-officials-too-afraid-to-tell-him-truth-of-war-against-ukraine-us-101648685425110.html
I think he just means reality in the sense of dealing in traditional terms of hard power, rather than imagining that reality can be created by the power of words and symbols alone.
That makes more sense.
I thinki agree with this one. Although I've if the most unexpected + bizarre statements, upon listening again to it, nothing really was said or claimed. It was just an opinion not explained further.
Fwiw that was also how I took James's comment. Putin seems to use the swarm, but also seems to use real guns to flex.
This was great; especially liked the theological trails. I really don't want to set up a Bitcoin wallet but guess I need to learn as this book is now on my list. Thanks for another thought-provoking podcast!
Love this series! Just in time for a long flight❤️
Sweet
I've been waiting on this. Thanks
My brain was too fried from work to digest the whole thing but it was super interesting
I think the Burroughs quote most appropriate is 'You thing RIKE jellyfish soon now' from Nova Express. I haven't listened to the whole episode, I will but - its hard, Jimmy is hard to follow and I'm an optimist - but has/is life changing more profoundly in terms of day to day existence than when electricity and other modern staples came into being in the late 19th/early 20th century in the US/Europe, etc.? To quote the French poet Charles Peguy: “The world changed less since Jesus Christ than in the last thirty years.” 1909 is what the google tells me.
I respect your request for blockchain purchase since it's your book and your choice.
As for me....... nope. I have a "Coinbase" account. I have NOT bought a bitcoin...... online. I just wanted to see how much info was collected and I declined to participate because I just didn't feel like linking my bank account to ANOTHER site.
I was impressed by the letter I received from the IRS about 6 weeks later politely asking if I had purchased any crypto currency.
Then later last year noticed the line on the IRS form asking me to just go ahead and declare any crypto that i may have bought.
I'm not a Luddite but remember how my grandfather said he survived and fought in the Mexican revolution. I will try to make myself a small blade of grass in a field of grass. Or as Mao said, " must move amongst the people as a fish swims in the sea.".
If you want to teach or help others, make it available. Imagine if Socrates/Plato/Christ had communicated their great thoughts but was only available in a form that only could be accessed by a unique coin of the realm and not available in any other manner. It would have died by exclusivity.
As for bearing the cross...
"Pain is inevitable, but suffering is optional."
Not my request. ;)
I meant it as a message to the author. Thank you for the reply.
I like the way you ask a question and then get out of the way. Larry King and Joe Rogan do/did the same thing. Jocko is also along those lines at times.
You must have a very busy schedule and I wish you much success.
Damn it. I guess this old Luddite is going to have to get some Bitcoin, because I definitely want to read this book. Hey James, unless I can send you 2 silver eagles!? Price is down on silver, it's a good time to get some.
Bitcoin is a Ponzi scheme. It has no value. Monasteries were a result of the Church filling the void left by the Roman Empire. The Church wasn’t a life raft between the Romans and the Nation-state, they captained the ship between the Roman Empire and the Nation-state. The reason this thread isn’t understanding the Bitcoin Monastery concept is that it makes no sense.
Brask Lapp: I heard this one and the Warmaster one back to back. I really loved the Warmaster one! Such good but serious topics can leave a listener inside out so i also appreciated how that episode did and with the music! It helped! But since I'll be writing about this episode and not in to flattering ways i wanted to point that out so i just don't go YouTube commentary on you. I have been looking forward to ep 3 so long and i find both first and second episodes interesting. Maybe this ep didn't stand a chance. Trilogy hypes and all.
I coughed up some coffee when those lines about (what i att first heard) Putin being so masculine and straight he got turned into a scapegoat for invading another country. Poor Putin!
After listening again very little was actually -said- about Putin in terms of stance. That said, "Putin doing manly did like riding horses barechested" photo shoot pays off well even to this day. North Korea tried with it too, but failed. At least we got memes! Thanks Un.
Important warning:
Personally I'm a bit of a swedish unicorn. I didn't just grow up Christian, i did it in our first prosperity style church in Sweden. I cannot in any way help NOT reading in the same motivations into that the author has when i (think) i hear the same kind of lines.
My 4th ventricle of my brain is by now triggered not just by foul water but also anything that relates to economy+religion/self help.
What i hear is: "buy the book with Bitcoin" in my cynical mind formed by the experience of christian sellpitches of past. Not verbatim ;"if you can't be bothered to take a leap of faith and maybe (legal prot.) strike gold in reward then i can't help you" ("friend" added to sand down the aggressive tone). "If you can't even create this new wallet with so much at stake, then you are lazy!" (Sand paper: "or whatever").
That said, i can't hear a evangelical'esque selling pitch without getting angry. For me i only hear a well thought out plan from when Bitcoin flew past the moon in value. "He'll either get rich if it spikes again or get a high horse to use in the future to point out his obvious non profiting intentions
are and thus even more credible. He's practically a saint!".
I didn’t enjoy this at all, it’s just proselytising dressed up in some not very good technobabble
Where have jihadis targeted kindergarteners like you suggest at minute 40?
Seems like USA (and Israel) militaries have a much higher proclivity for killing children than jihadis groups.
haven't had a chance to listen yet (really looking forward to it!).. FYI, took a look at the site to order the book and folks should know that it's not bought with the Bitcoin (BTC) everyone is familiar with, rather BSV which is a diff chain forked of BTC. this could be confusing for folks new to crypto. y'all should know BSV is fine to transact with to buy the book for example, but the guy behind BSV (Craig Wright) falsely claims to to be Satoshi Nakamoto and is a basically a discredited cult leader in the crypto world. nfa, dyor, run-dmc, etc..
The intra-crypto sectarian disputes as even more opaque to me than the technology itself.
You have just encouraged your subscribers to purchase a currency that the majority of Bitcoiners deem a scam.
You've obviously never used Bitcoin
Only for 10 years
You've been using a scam for 10 years?
are you a troll or a BSV shill? pls provide thoughtful points or GTFO, ser
Who the fuck are you talking too? The dude called it a scam then said he's been using it for 10 years. What the hell is that all about?
Nobody asked your shitheel opinion anyway.
You couldn't make me gtfo if your life depended on it. So get your ass of your shoulders and pipe down.
BSV is NOT Bitcoin, rather it is a modified copy of Bitcoin (BTC). a counterfeit operation in essence. you're either confused about that fact or intentionally misleading people to believe that BSV is Bitcoin. the latter case would place you in the category of huckster/fraud/shill. the gentleman you were tersely responding to in this thread has clearly made the delineation by pointing to his experience with BTC (legit Bitcoin) and expressing warning against investing deeply in BSV (illegitimate Bitcoin). forgive me if it's just a case of you being confused about that, it seemed clear to me
scam might be a harsh word. it's one thing to buy a little BSV & go through the process of ordering the book and exploring the space in general, it's another to speculate on BSV value and make a meaningful investment. Craig Wright's dubious origins and aspirations aside, i personally had no problem obtaining BSV to order the book and really look forward to further exploring the author's ideas. also, as someone semi crypto literate, have enjoyed taking a closer look at the BSV ecosystem and will probably continue to poke around only for educational purposes. from an author/publisher standpoint, seems that building on top of an L2 ETH chain would make the most sense in the longer term, but maybe wasn't really a mature/viable option at the inception of Canonic. maybe BSV goes the path of Urbit and ends up being some shady corner of the interwebs, maybe not, but agree with author it's good for people to dip toes in crypto sphere with eyes wide open wearing a sceptics hat (key skill for the future)
Scam is not harsh enough. The leaders of BSV have been threatening the livelihood of a friend of mine in a ridiculous lawsuit.
At very least those new to "crypto" should know that it is widely seen as a scam, and has been delisted from most exchanges because of that.
Canonic gets nothing, other then buzzword compliance, from "using" BSV. It is not decentralised (only 30 nodes)
that's a fair apolitical warning.. sorry to hear that about your friend. agree that BSV being someone's intro to crypto is basically asking them to learn a few things the hard way. personally i'll never invest, but i did grab the book which doesn't benefit BSV so much, just another dirty currency for me. better for business if Canonic evolves to another chain in the long run
yeah, it's super hard to parse the signal from noise, and almost impossible without having a deep understanding of the tech & which voices can be trusted to audit it. code is law and all that
Thinking more on this, the emphasis on crypto currency being a force for salvation seems strange to me.
https://www.epiqglobal.com/en-us/resource-center/articles/blockchain-can-be-hacked
https://theupheaval.substack.com/p/just-say-no-to-cbdcs
https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/05/blockchain-of-command/528543/
I don’t really get it either. I will bring him, and maybe Ardian (founder of Canonic) on to address specific questions people have.
Man, it's heartbreaking to see so many people downloading BSV wallets as a first foray into Bitcoin. This is a serious error.
Lmao “the internet thinks”. Got me too, I’ve been thinking about that line ever since you put out that episode
you know, I made it through an advanced engineering degree and all the hard ass coursework involved in that, successfully worked in that for 15 years, along with a lot of other pursuits requiring brain work, so I usually like to think I'm at least moderately intelligent, and then I listen to you guys go back and forth and I feel dumber than a bag of hammers.....
Darryl, I am once again going to recommend to you the work of Jonathan Pageau. Some of your comments in this episode about technological "intelligence" and its connection to principalities comes very close to the things he talks about. He is an Orthodox Christian, but his arguments come from a different angle than James, more theological than political. I believe your fear that the internet "thinks" may be closer to reality than many realize. Pageu shows how the patterns presented in the The Book of Enoch mirror the modern world, in which technological forces are unleashed upon the world and devour it, leading to the flood. He emphasizes the role of principalities and transpersonal intelligences which manifest themselves at multiple levels of reality. Ultimately, he soberly concludes, that an AI will be a "fallen angel".
The worry is not that AI will yield “monsters” that we can’t control. The worry should be for the “priest class” of AI/algorithm engineers that hold the monster’s leash.
Isn't it all about movement. To maintain some level of freedom, we need to operate within an uncorrupted system until it becomes corrupted. Those among us will usually identify the early signs and move to position themselves to create a new system for others to follow. The political system of the USA was in part constructed to deal with corruption of power. But, it didn't prevent absolute corruption across the board. This is why the American experiment appears to be currently failing. Early days yet though. I was stood at the stonehenge in Salisbury yesterday. I left with two thoughts. The perception of time and self. So very different to today. I was looking at something that was more important than both of those things to my ancestors, or rather, was created under a different perception. Something that was being created generation after generation for thousands of years. A place that had a name that is now lost from memory. But that name would have been known across the Isles and probably over the waters. People would have come from all over to be a part of it in some way. Something more important than time and self.
Hello Darryl,
I found this about the Claremont Institute… is this substantiated?
“The Claremont Institute, once a little-known think tank often confused with the liberal-arts college of the same name, has emerged as a driving force in the conservative movement’s crusade to use bogus fraud claims about the 2020 election to rewrite voting laws and remake the election system in time for the 2022 midterms and 2024 presidential election. Most infamously, one of the group’s legal scholars crafted memos outlining a plan for how then-Vice President Mike Pence could potentially overturn the last election.”
The Claremont Institute has a wide variety of thinkers and writers, with a variety of views on the 2020 election.
I found an article that James wrote about crypto because I was just as confused as everyone else about the bitcoin monasteries. The way I read it, it is related the way that governments currently pressure payment processors to prevent money from going to certain groups. i.e the Canadian truckers fund and the Kyle Rittenhouse legal fund. Crypto allows for payments without the possibility of it being controlled or stopped due to an ideological bent. it was a term he started using during the podcast without ever defining why it mattered. Maybe I missed it.
https://english.aawsat.com/home/article/3200691/james-poulos/how-bitcoin-can-immunize-america-cancel-culture
Great podcast until he started going on about crypto. There is no “there, there” when it comes to Crypto. He lost me there.
Aristotle
"That which alive has soul, that which is not, doesn't" @1:06:51
disagree. a tree, a plant, a dog, a bird is alive, do you know it has a soul or not?
Is it not part the all? God?
My wooden table appears solid, yet the electrons, protons, neutrons (molecules) are still moving.
Alive or Not?
Being human isn't something we were thrust into, we are a soul having a human experience, very different than what is taught in religion.
I agree we are in a battle to become more human verse less
Humanity vs Transhumanism
and that has taken on many forms, playing out right now in 2024...and what is happening isn't something new it is something being shown, So we can make a choice
Humanity vs Transhumanism
The choice point is coming very fast, it has been 2 years since this podcast aired, and I will venture to say many feel like we are in a runaway train.
The energy of humanity is coming to a choice point.
Have you ever read
Propaganda
Edward L. Bernays
Another vote for a return to this conversation and a return to your own Lacanian and related thoughts—not a bad model (monologue, discussion) to explore stuff this dense and far-ranging.
Meow
I love listening to people like Daryl and James. I imagine that how I feel listening to them is how others feel listening to me. I’m not comparing my intellect to theirs, but rather they both express such lucid ways of thinking whilst laughing in the face of their own blinding contradictions.
I mean how does using crypto to buy his book not expedite the inevitable government controlled digital dollar? As if the “government” doesn’t already control crypto (it likely does), surely the more adopters of crypto currency now only speeds up the race into governmental digital dominance.
And how does someone fight so adamantly for logic whilst promoting a completely illogical book like the Bible?
I believe the quote, “intelligence is the ability to have two contradictory ideas in your head and still function,” is of the utmost value to all humans. And I have faith in a higher power and do not find any reason to question the faith of others, whatever it may be. However, when it comes to a book written with formal logic, I’m forced to question it logically.
Nevertheless, pretty amazing conversation.
Great episode, I’ve been waiting for this one. Especially appreciated James’ discussion of tech and culture and kids-- I’m a mom of teen boys and parenting through this time is incredibly difficult. It often seems as if none of my GenX experience with school/friends/dating/college relates to what our boys are facing. I feel like I got a little pep talk from James and I needed that! Now just need to figure out how to order that book.
Hi everyone, I just wanted to see if anyone else had a similar reaction to the site the book is posted on? I was pretty excited to get a copy of the new book after being introduced to James and his thought over the past several months as the dialogue with Darryl has developed. After hearing the last interview I thought it was great that James wanted others to wade into the cypto space and put a little skin in the peer to peer game. I'm asking because I don't have any experience with Canonic but all the NFT's and the site only accepting BSV gives me pause. I am a strong supporter of BTC as well as decentralized networks. I believe the core ideas behind Bitcoin are very powerful and I would love an option to just send the author BTC and not have to expose my system to swapping altcoins or messing with bitcoin cash (BSV).
Anyway, Thank You Darryl and James for the thoughtful and spirited discussion as well as a community worth participating in and paying close attention to.
I subscribe to martyrmade and I have had the hardest time posting here. Not a boomer but never felt like such a boomer.
I want to read this book but I’m not familiar with the block chain or a bitcoin wallet. Need help.
is ok. i know that feeling and will try to help as i'm really enjoying the book. we can have a conversation here if you like.. general rule for crypto is to be wary of DMs as that is where the scams happen.
regarding Canonic 'how to' suggestion to use HandCash, i would advise against that as it silos you in $BSV ecosystem, which introduces a number of complicating factors. the more mainstream how-to approach would be something like this (buy $BTC, swap for $BSV and deposit to Canonic account)...
1) open an account with Coinbase.com (CB), buy $60 worth of $BTC (mainstream Bitcoin), wait the 7 days or so for bank transfer into your CB account to clear so you can then transfer out your $BTC
2) go to canonic.xyz and open an account, go to your profile and click 'Receive', this will present your $BSV wallet address to buy the book with (e.g. 1MSVjkvbCiJxyrP3XsdHiQZH8561eYWeXx). note this address
3) verify funds have cleared in your coinbase account. i.e. if you click 'withdraw' you will see the available $BTC balance instead of 0.0
4) note the deposit address for $BTC in your coinbase account. i.e. go to Bitcoin, click Deposit, select 'Crypto Address' (e.g. 36784jA7xoe8uauRMFKapxw8Q2uKRwYgmg)
5) now you are ready to swap some of your $BTC for $BSV and have it land in you Canonic wallet to buy the book...
6) go to coinshuffle.io and click 'Start Swapping' > select BTC for Send > select BSV for Recieve > click Min > click Exchange Now > enter your $BSV address obtained in step #2 above for the Recieve address > enter the $BTC address obtained in step #4 above for the refund address > click Lock This Rate ....
7) step #6 will present you with the coinshuffle.io wallet address you are sending the $BTC to from Coinbase.. copy this address and the amount (e.g. 0.00404) then go to Coinbase and > click withdraw Bitcoin > select Crypto Address > enter the address in the 'To' field as well as the amount > click Withdrawal
8) now go back to your screen on coinshuffle.io and you should see the transaction complete in ~10 minutes. what you have just done is sent ~$40 worth of $BTC to coinshuffle, who will then convert that to $BSV and deposit it in you Canonic account after taking a small fee
9) once the coinshuffle transaction is complete you can check your Canonic profile balance and should see you have a balance to purchase the book with (can take about 10 minutes to show up). your canonic balance will show as ~$40 but it's really $BSV so your balance value will fluctuate with market value of $BSV
10) now you can buy the book from canonic for $30, which will leave a balance of $BSV there worth ~$10 (you will also have a balance of $BTC left in your CB account worth ~$20)
As someone who comes from and still is in a very conservative group, the question of what to do with tech and what effects it has is very much on everyone's mind. I really appreciated the podcast and am sharing it with friends. I certainly have a lot crypto scepticism though, I can see why Poulos pushes it.
The simplest question to ask whether Bitcoin is a future monetary tool is this: What is money? No, the answer is not a medium of exchange, although it is an added benefit of using “money” it’s not why money was invented.
Couldn’t handle the all the “uh”. Every third or fourth word. Painful. I will just keep listening to all the other episodes on this Podcast, because they are incredibly good, until a new one comes out.
I really want to get a copy of Human Forever, but I cannot work out how to do it. I’ve spent 100usd and i now have some bsv and some btc in some wallets somewhere. I can’t work out how to transfer the funds to handcash let alone canonical, i keep having to sign in with double authentication, and I’m fed up with scouring google only to read how easy it is all supposed to be. PLEASE can someone explain it to me like I’m a six year old. I’m not stupid, I don’t think, just impatient, and oh SO frustrated.
Trust me, you're not stupid. I eventually had to get help as well. I will get a set of clear instructions from James or Ardian and post them here.
With some help from an old crypto hand my copy of HF is on its way. One thing I found out is that using crypto is not like a one-click purchase with a credit card. I bought some BSV with a credit card and expected it to be immediately available for use. However, the credit card transaction takes ten days to clear. Until it clears, if you try to withdraw/send anything, the crypto exchange/wallet will tell you that you you are required to keep all your funds in there. It doesn't tell you why - you have to read the terms/support. My tendency with these things is to jump in and have a go first and read the instructions later.
This book is not available for Bitcoin!
"Canonic only accepts Bitcoin(BSV)"
They are not the same thing.
BSV is a fork (copy) of Bitcoin created in 2018 by Satoshi cosplayer, serial forger, fraudster, patent troll, etc... Craig Wright: https://craigwright.online/
Craig Wright is suing a friend of mine so there is no chance I will use his shitcoin, so I can't purchase this book. Shame, I was interested in some of the ideas.
It’s all Greek to me, sorry.
I understand that. The main thing you need to know is BSV has been delisted by most exchanges, of course BSV supporters think that is a huge Bilderberg/Mastercard conspiracy against "the TRUE Bitcoin"
BSV is the Qanon of crypto, so when I listened to the end of your last episode it sounded like "If you're not up to date with current events, take some responsibility and dip your toe into QAnon, I don't understand it myself, but just read a bit of it"
Also that it's encoded into "the blockchain" is nothing special. It's the Bitcoin SV blockchain backed by ~30 nodes.
Really enjoyed this installment. I had been thinking of wokery as warmed over, cynical puritanism/Calvinism, but looking at it as an organizing principle for increasingly complex society makes a lot of sense.
I think Malcolm Kyeyune makes some good points RE: cyborg wokeism being a filtering method and field of competition for overproduced elites. He also has some insightful criticism of the European/anglo left. Ever thought about having a conversation with him?