Hi everybody. I recently got an email from a young Palestinian girl. It was maybe the most beautiful, and most rewarding, email I’ve ever gotten from doing this podcast, and I wanted to share it with all of you. Sometimes, it seems near impossible, at a time of heightened tension and polarization, to cut through the noise and get people to see that most of the people affected by a conflict like the one between Israelis and Palestinians are normal, innocent people no different from you or me. But I’m going to keep banging that drum anyway. Thanks for listening.
Here's the text of the email (with a few typos cleaned up by me):
"Hey! :D
I hope this e-mail finds you well. Apologies in advance for the English. I am not a native speaker. Originally from Gaza. Im (name).. 20 years old. I was able to secure the necessary permits to move to the west bank about 2 years ago to stay with my aunt and uncle while i conduct my studies. i hope to be a nurse (hebron).
I found your tweets a while ago and have followed you on twitter a while. I listened to your podcast series for weeks. Some of it i knew, some of it i didn't. It was nice to hear an non-biased non-arab (presumably not jewish) narrate the history of my people. At the start of episode 2 i realised they are just like me. The jews, I mean. They wanted their own land and came with hopes and dreams to secure a better future for their loved ones and families. I think there is probably a jewish girl my age wanting peace with us.
I know your media views us as vermin, but we aren't. One of the reasons i follow you is not just your podcast but you see us as humans which is so rare for people in america.
I don't believe israelis are bad or that jewish people are bad. I know in gaza there are many that do, but it is sometimes hard to escape that after what they have done. My family still lives in a cage.
The blockcade has destroyed the economy! Sometimes ten hours without electricity! Israel has a thriving economy. Tech centre of the middle east. We don't even have our own airport. We don't have good infrastructure. We haven't been able to rebuild. We have nothing. Even in the west bank they terorrirse us all the time. It makes people angry and resentful.
But there are many like me and my friend Fatimah, who even prayed for the Israelis when the attacks happened on the 7th. I pray Allah grants them Jannah. Those people at the concert did not choose this life any more than i did. My heart is sad for their families, what was done to them cannot be forgiven ever :( and allah won't forgive those that did it.
My own parents and siblings are in Gaza. Every day i hear from them i thank allah they are alive. He is merciful for sparing them. They would rather die then leave gaza and never be able to go back. When the bombs came near my home in 2019 i did not care. I was ready. I did not cower. When you grow up in Gaza you prepare for death. My heart is so broken for my people, i do not have enough tears left. Everyday new buildings. My old school destroyed. My uncles shop in Gaza in ruins.
One of the reason i adored your podcast and listened to it twice was you make us sound so similar. By us i mean us palestinians and the jewish. We are just both brothers/sisters, jewish and arab who want the same thing. A place to call home. They were just like me. The difference is when they die your media mourns them in a way it never mourns us. In 2018 so many of us died and yet nobody mourns us and humanises us in death. They have articles for lone IDF soldiers who die in israel. But when our boys die in the west bank, nothing is said..Just those dumb arabs that deserve it.
We did not get a say in how Gaza was run. I would not vote for them! My dad in fact hates them he calls the hamas leaderships corrupt baboons. He knew young boys who he teaches who join the resistance and he feels so sad for them. Sad because they were sweet innocent boys who saw their families killed by the israelis and then are driven to go fight for a group that does not care for them.
My friend Rakeem i played with when i was younger. He saw both of his parents die from the israelis. He also saw his grandparents, one sister and baby brother aged 2 die. Only him and his sister lived. He carried his little brothers corpse for hours when the bombs came to Gaza. He was only 11. Those are the boys that become angry and vengeful and rather than nurture the anger to do something good hamas exploits it.
My dad always say hamas do not care for the lives of these boys and that those boys could have done something great had they been given a chance to, but instead they will die fighting for leaders who do not care!!!! Good boys who are now bad men and ruined. But what can we do ? Fight with our bare hands against guns? Just as silly as to think we can fight off israeli bombs with our hands.
And once the resistance is gone i don't see we will have peace! I cannot see the occupation ending ... What's next for Gaza? i do not even blame IDF soldiers, they are just as brainwashed as hamas to do their job. i blame the israeli government for making them treat us this way!!! Their governemnt is viciously evil! Towns, shops , home in gaza destroyed, they don't even allow in building materials. So many dead in gaza. The survellience in the west bank is now worse than before! Settlers are legally allowed to carry guns to shoot at us! But if we fight back where will be our right to defend against the settlers? Children are trauamtized.
The material conditions for palestinians won't improve. And through the ashes hamas' ideas will be martyred and then it will change a whole group of young innocent kids who will become even more vengeful after seeing their families killed. You cannot bomb your way to changing hamas' ideas. Only improvement in our current state will see us change and make sure the childen of Palestine understand that the jews also care for them. Education is a must, then the Palestinians children will grow up caring for the Jewish. Otherwise if they are forced into the cage again then you will see something new emerge in a decades' time, and a new group will commit something much worse than the events of October 7th.
If you ever choose to come to Falastin, my university would love to welcome you. We have had a few Americans visit that are sympathetic to us and like understanding our side of the conflict and how we can make peace and get a proper state! We are very gracious hosts!!! I shared your podcast with my two friends, i hope they will listen. They promised me they would but it is extremely long so may take them time to get through. My uncle Abdal is listening. He is 15 minutes through episode 1. He is such a kind gentleman who wants to make peace with the jewish folk, even though he knows they think of us badly more than ever now. He was sad when Rabin died. He said Rabin was good. He hates bibi.
Some of the comments i see on your page make me sad. I want to comment then stop myself because as to not invite hate. (Also i run a harry styles fan account on twitter so i think i would just draw to much attention haha) But i wish people could see that we too are human beings with simple dreams. Mine is to go to a Harry Styles or Kehlani concert. And to get to 100k tiktok followers. To visit my amazing internet friends in Europe who i met on twitter. For the Americans to see us as human beings also, the way they see Israelis as humans. We aren't that different from the Americans, we just have a different flag. I also want my country to become liberated, to end our occupation and to restore the dignitiy of my people. i want a peaceful government. i do not want the jewish to die anymore then i want my own to die. I do not want to see buildings and homes and stores in my city turned into nothing. I don't want to be sad everytime my family calls because i am so anxious thinking someone has died. The situation at home is so bad :( And i don't know why some Americans seem to like seeing us suffer.
I wrote a lot here... But once again as a girl from Falastin thank you for telling our story. Thank you for telling their story too and how our tales overlap in a way that not many can appreciate. May you have great prosperity and happiness.
I’ve been with you since around the time the Fear and Loathing series dropped and have been hooked since. You always put out quality stuff but your commitment to your Christian faith of seeing the dignity in the individual and fighting the urge to turn them into abstractions is truly remarkable and so needed in this context. You are doing inspirational modeling by challenging your audience to resist the temptation to take the easy way out by painting one side as monsters. Keep it up. You are doing God’s work and forcing me to do some serious soul searching.
This letter gave me chills. I don’t believe I’m being hyperbolic when I say that your series on the conflict is one of the most important podcast series ever recorded.
I’ve recommended your Fear and Loathing podcast to peers and every person, literally every one, came away less polarized and more empathetic to the Israelis and Palestinians, just wishing for peace. It’s been a spell breaker for people, and I mean that in the most human of ways.
Whenever people think there’s not a way out and conflict is necessary, it’s a good reminder that there’s always a way to more humanity, it just needs better leaders and messaging for it to occur. We’re all unique people with unique motives, desires, and dreams, which can be empathized and reasoned with.
And we shouldn’t forget that, even when bombed out Palestinians or beheaded Israelis fill us with absolute rage.
I could not have cared less for Palestine until I listened to fear and loathing. Hated everything about the podcast but ended up listening to it at least three times. It’s tough to realize everything you thought you knew about something isn’t true. That series has brought a big number of people to have a lot more empathy for all the people suffering in that region.
Bro my measurements for toughness is like hours worked or how light of clothes I can wear when it’s cold. Some of these episodes make me feel like a total American dough boy
Mr. Cooper- I've listened & subscribed for a long time, and I'm very appreciative for all of the work that you've shared. It's enriched my life a great deal. This is the first time I've commented or engaged. While my deepest sympathies (as a free and unfuckingstoppable woman, with many lgbt people and Jews and other assorted haram types in my closest personal circle) will always lie with the democratic West and it's imperfectly executed but ultimately superior ethical framework, I have been grateful for the nuance and provocation to deeper thinking that your own worldview has provided. I was touched by this girl's note. It is a good object lesson in the ways that we all essentialize each other. She spoke about "Americans" in the same way that she seems to think that all Americans talk about "Palestinians", as if we are a monolith. It's human nature. I'm sure people on the internet are engaging in all kinds of Neanderthal rhetoric around this nightmare, on all sides. In the vein of "most people are basically decent", I have to believe that the vast majority of people around the world understand that Hamas doesn't represent all Palestinians. However, the horrible truth is that until the many Palestinian people of good heart and good faith decide to rise up, and reject with force and conviction the monstrous ideology that has grown up within their community, they will never be free. The outside world cannot free Palestinians (or Muslims more broadly) from the darkest tendencies that exist in their group, any more than any outside force could save America from the moral crime of slavery. We had to fight nearly to our national death to become righteous, and we are fighting still. The Palestinians will have to fight themselves for liberation, before Israel or any other power can set them free. If they do, they will find that they have more allies in their fight against external oppression than they can even imagine. I believe the Israelis would be first among their allies, in fact.
I would like your young letter writer to know: how many of us pray every day that the decent people in her world will gain the upper hand against the terrorists and the merchants of hatred. We know you are there, and we know that you are the first, and most numerous, and most tragic victims of Hamas/ISIS/Taliban/Hezbollah etc. All decent people are weeping for you, and are yearning for you to be free, so that you may put your desperately needed shoulders to the wheel beside us, as we continue to strive towards the ideal of universal human freedom. Godspeed.
The slave states of the United States were stopped by an outside force. The people of the slave society did not rise up and overthrow the slave owners. The change did not come from within. The slave south refused to do what outsiders told it to and then the outsiders forced their states to change.
If the northern states had imposed a regime as cruel as Israel’s on the south, you can bet that vicious guerrilla fighting would have continued for decades until the cycle of reciprocal atrocity tore the country back into two. White southerners railed against the occupation of the north as unjust and oppressive, but ultimately the north’s policy it forced on the rebellious states has nothing of the brutal dehumanization that Palestine has experienced. The extremist resistance movements of the south such as the ku klux klan were suppressed with targeted anti-insurgency campaigns. Not with indiscriminate massacre. Because while the north was an outside power imposing its moral will on the south, it did not dehumanize southerners or treat them like animals.
All of that is to say, your analogy to the US Civil War is completely inappropriate, because the population that practiced slavery did not rise up and overthrow the institution. The north did not rise up against its own leaders. The south seceded and formed another country whose leadership was overthrown from above and then the occupiers proceeded to rebuild the society they had invaded.
To be somewhat fair I think that after Sherman and Reconstruction the people of places like Atlanta might disagree that what they faced was less dehumanizing than what Israel is doing to Palestine. Israel has done some rotten things but they haven’t gone scorched earth. Yet.
I take your points, and thank you for them. However, your story about the American Civil War, while consisting of statements that are not facially false, doesn't exactly qualify as a definitive description of what I think most people could agree was a fairly complex period in history. We could do point/counterpoint forever, I suppose- I could bring up Southern Unionists and the fact that the north bothered to fight at all, you could bring up the northern need for southern raw materials and the cynicism of politicians...but it's already a bit boring, no? Tedious legalistic arguments aside, I hope you agree at least a little with my heartfelt well-wishes for the blameless souls whose wicked lot in life it is to be the victims of history, which was really the only point I cared about making.
Well said. I kind of had tunnel vision there for a minute and got fixated on the point, for some reason. (I might be a little sleep deprived today.) Anyway, I share your sentiment for the people involved and I wish you a good night or day wherever you are
Thank you for sharing this, it’s hard for me to hear these stories and not want to put on my tin foil hat and think that maybe war is the goal in and of itself. The military industrial complex cannot self sustain without these ongoing conflicts. They seem to be almost inevitable as long as the people in power are controlled by the money that is to be profited from war. We talk a big game about peace and democracy in the US but looking at our actions it really seems to me that we are a country addicted to war and always looking for a fight. It makes me very sad that so many people suffer globally because of our brainwashed population and a handful of greedy elites controlling the purse strings.
The changes that were made to the American economy so it could become the "Armory of Democracy" also locked it into that role. The US has been riding a bubble since 1945; if the wars dry up, the whole ponzi scheme falls apart.
Darryl, there's a strange phenomenon. A kind of conflation I've been seeing a lot. My pro-Israel Jewish friends are very aware that Israel withdrew from Gaza in 2005. But, listening to you (and many other American commenters) it would be really easy to think that Gaza has been militarily occupied for decades, just like the West Bank. Gaza is blockaded, but that's a different thing from occupation.
This episode is a great example of this kind of conflation. There was a terrorist attack launched from Gaza, followed by Israeli bombardment of Gaza and now invasion of Gaza, and in order to help us understand the context of these events, you convey to us ... stories about the military occupation of the West Bank and a letter from a resident of the West Bank. It makes me feel like you're trying to pull a fast one. All these stories about checkpoints and stun grenades ... that's not happening in Gaza, because the Israelis withdrew from Gaza.
I think a lot of Americans genuinely don't know about the Israeli withdrawal from Gaza in 2005, because commenters like you don't talk about it. But that has to be an important part of the story here, right? You can't explain why these attacks were launched from Gaza (rather than the West Bank, or somewhere else) without that piece of the puzzle.
And it's a very important piece of why my pro-Israel Jewish friends think about the situation the way they do. For them, blockading Gaza instead of occupying it was a test run of the two state solution. Can they live in peace with the Palestinians without directly occupying and oppressing them? Can "good fences make good neighbors"? Very sadly, that question seems to have been answered.
I strongly approve of your efforts to humanize both sides. Good job! But I also want to rely on you for relevant historical context. What gives? Or am I being tricked by Israeli propaganda?
The Israelis withdrew their personnel, but then just placed the city under siege. They control the airspace, they control how far out to sea Gazan fishing boats are allowed to go, they control the movement of people in/out of Gaza, and they control whether and how much food, medicine, rebuilding supplies, and other resources are allowed in. The whole place is surrounded by a wall patrolled by remotely-controlled robotic machine guns. Indeed, given the change in tactics toward Gaza after the withdrawal - away from counter-insurgency, targeted assassinations, etc to full-blown military assaults - it's pretty clear that the decision was made by Israel to pull their people out to give them a freer hand when "mowing the lawn."
Wait, is it really true that Israel controls the movement of people and goods in and out of Gaza? I was just reading this Wikipedia article about the Rafah Crossing (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rafah_Border_Crossing) and it makes it seem like it's mostly Egypt in charge of Rafah.
"On 3 February 2008, the border was closed again by Egypt"
"on 29 April, Egypt announced that the border crossing would be opened on a permanent basis."
"On 22 January 2015, Egypt closed the border crossing."
"In May 2018, Egyptian authorities opened the crossing"
"In February 2021, Egypt opened the crossing "indefinitely" for the first time in years"
As for supplies, the Wikipedia "Gaza imports" article (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza_imports) says: "The Rafah Border Crossing is the sole crossing point between Egypt and the Gaza Strip. It has been closed for the transfer of commercial goods since 2007, and Egypt maintained that it would only open the crossing if forces from the Palestinian Authority presidential guard and a European supervisory force returned to guard the border crossing."
I don't want to argue just to argue; the Rafah Crossing and the involvement of Egypt is important, because it's a significant difference between military occupation and blockade. If Gaza was genuinely militarily occupied by Israel, Egypt wouldn't matter -- Israel could just set up a checkpoint in front of Rafah. But under blockade, Gaza has a significant degree of freedom that it wouldn't have under occupation: they can go to Egypt, if Egypt will let them.
And the Egypt border situation is a big plank in the pro-Israel side's arguments: You can tell that the problem is with Hamas, not Israel, they say, because Egypt has the same problems with Hamas as Israel does.
I know Wikipedia can be biased, and I didn't check its sources. Do I have false facts? Or is there more context I need to really understand it? Like, is Egypt secretly an Israeli puppet?
This is mendacious nonsense. The restrictions on sovereignty are either (a) perfectly reasonable measures to stop Gaza being used as a base to attack Israelis (which clearly didn't go far enough) and (b) measures taken after Gazans overwhelmingly elected Hamas* and Hamas attacked Israel. 'Mowing the lawn' is a concept invented afterwards when the military reported back that Hamas was too well dug in to re-occupy the Gaza strip without massive casualties. It's basically a fancy word for Cope.
In 2005, Gaza benefitted from massive international aid, and, even more importantly, massive international good will. It's not an exaggeration to say that had they decided to set up an international tax haven they would have been allowed to go ahead with it. What they actually did is celebrate their victory over Israel and start pressing ahead for more victories. Sure, not everyone felt this way, and no doubt many 17 year old girls would have preferred to focus on Harry Styles, but that it was Palestinians collectively chose.
What this shows is that the 2 State Solution is a complete non starter. Whatever deal is made, there will be some conditions attached to it that mean ackshully Palestinians are under occupation, Palestinians will attack because this is all they actually want to do, and deep thinkers will justify it. Every single step towards the 2 State Solution has made everything worse, for Israelis, for Palestinians, for everyone.
*While overall the 2006 elections were close, Hamas won a massive victory in Gaza itself hence their subsequent takeover.
If Trump got 56% everyone would say this was a massive victory. What is the pertinence of saying Hamas do not speak for everyone (something that is probably true of any regime anywhere, ever)?
Note that there was an alternative:
"Also known as the National Coalition for Justice and Democracy, the Wa'ad list was headed by Gazan Eyad El-Sarraj, who was a consultant to the Palestinian delegation to the Camp David 2000 Summit and heads a group of Palestinian and Israeli academics working towards a peace agreement.[17] The list's main platform is security reforms, establishing the rule of law and respect for human rights."
Guess how many seats they got? (It rhymes with 'hero').
You're right, people might say that, but is it true? No, 56% is not a massive victory. 56% is almost literally if you and 9 and of your friends voted and 6 of you wanted something and 4 of you didn't (I say almost because the situation I describe is actually a larger margin of victory than 56% but I digress). Is that massive? Hardly. Just like you probably don't want someone throwing you in an identity or ideological group that you aren't part of or don't like so those 44% probably don't either. Maybe they should be speaking up louder maybe a lot of things, but also maybe they are scared and persecuted and don't want to be killed in the crossfire...the at least 5% of Palestinian Christians that make up the Gazan population I'd be willing to bet don't.
The pertinence is to remind people that Hamas is not everyone and so to simply speak in terms that removes the humanity of the innocent people on the other side simply because they live mixed within that side is a dangerous path to head down so that we do not slowly turn into the evil we are seeking to be rid of.
To be clear, in response to whatever you are assuming, my belief is that civilians should never be targeted in war, even if they are provably Nazi paedophile space aliens. The purpose of the rules of law are to limit and contain conflict, not to administrate abstract justice.
Now, as regards the public opinion of people in Gaza. First, what you probably haven't even considered is that some people who did not vote for Hamas are just as or *more* extreme. The PFLP, which quite recently entered a synagogue in West Jerusalem and massacred the people there, gouging out their eyes, also did quite well. Further, many Fatah supporters are also rejectionists, but they don't support Hamas because they are not into strict Islam. Again, Gaza has a peace party. It got no seats, because peace is not a popular policy in Gaza; war is.
I appreciate the response! So you would say that it's a de facto military occupation, basically. The seeming difference between the West Bank and Gaza is actually a propaganda smokescreen, which the Israel apologists have failed to see through. And the Israelis didn't really make any kind of concession or sacrifice when they "withdrew", it was just a different strategy for the same oppression.
I had been under the impression that Hamas was able to flourish in Gaza only because of Israel taking a genuine hands-off stance. If it was really so locked down, how could such a violently anti-Israel group become the government?
It’s my understanding that Hamas much like bin Laden received a fair amount of support from governments that would later come to regret that support under the premise that the enemy of my enemy is my friend. On top of that there are always people who are willing to profit off conflict.
Think about it for a minute. The US government just sent a pile of US taxpayer dollars and weapons constructed with US taxpayer dollars to Israel to fight Hamas. Hamas is using, at least in part, weapons paid for by the U.S. taxpayer and abandoned in Afghanistan. The US also sent a pile of US taxpayer dollars to help humanitarian efforts in Gaza, a substantial chunk of which will undoubtedly wind up in the control of Hamas since they hold the power in Gaza. So the US taxpayer is paying for both sides of the conflict. Meanwhile those in the US government do everything possible to pay the least amount of tax possible and also own a pile of defense contracting stocks that are doing very well right now. So the US taxpayer foots the bill for both sides of a war that has little to nothing to do with us and our political elite get rich on war profiteering. Then they raise our taxes to pay for their war. I highly doubt the American government is any sort of special sort of evil and suspect this is more the norm for how the world’s governments operate. I suspect there are plenty of people in the Israeli government who will benefit from instability and lose power or control if peace is ever established. That is why Hamas was allowed to come into and maintain power.
Israel did pull out of Gaza and Darryl has talked about that. He also mentioned in those letters that those incidents took place in the West Bank.
Walling off Gaza “contained” the problem until it didn’t. Certainly no one really thinks that confining people into a ghetto or open air prison indefinitely would result in them feeling that they have a good quality of life. Nor would it result in them slowly gaining an understanding and empathy for the people keeping them walled in.
I live in a nice neighborhood that is very pleasant. I have all the things I need and I like it here. If you built a wall around it, restricted my movement, my food, my access to medical care, my electricity etc. I think you would find out pretty quickly that my nice neighborhood is no longer filled with pleasant people.
Hey Darryl, I must confess that after 2 years subscribing I made the decision a few weeks ago to end my subscription. It was a combination of finances and the recent content hadn’t been as interesting to me as what has come before. However, since October 7 I have been extremely impressed with your views on the Israel-Palestine issue. I simply cannot imagine missing what is to come. I got an email today saying that my subscription was ending tomorrow and I have gladly renewed. All the best.
That’s very generous of you, but no need thank you. I insist on paying and I’m happy to. It’s well worth it and what you are trying to do is absolutely worth it
she could have been a jew talking about the boys who joined the irgun.
i, a jew. have also lived inside islam. i don't mean inside a muslim country--i mean inside islam. the religions are identical. the good parts are identical. the crazy is identical. the language of mercy and the language of revilement are identical.
and for any believer of either faith, there will always be a floor to their mercy, if they truly take as god's word the dogma of their religion.
i was once friendly with a pakistani family who were educated urbane people. they'd lived for awhile in australia while the father completed an advanced degree. they had lots of foreign friends.
one day i was out walking with the two elder daughters who were a little younger than i. we were together almost every day; they lived across the street from the people i was staying with. they spoke perfect english. and that day, the older girl said to me--and she was almost 20 years old and was studying pre-med--that she really shouldn't be friends with me because i was a jew and the quran told her that was a bad thing to do.
she did keep being friendly with me. but who likes receiving a sort of convenient special dispensation?
all cults are bad. a jewish claim to the region of our ethnic origin is perfectly legitimate and valid based on historical and archaeological and genetic realities. bolstering that with religious bullshit is bad.
just as claiming that the arabs now calling themselves palestinians are not originally colonizers and the fruit of conquering waves throughout history is untruthful.
this can't be fixed while adherents of three cults keep bringing myths into a historical and political minefield.
As someone born and raised in a Western country, but with family in the West Bank, thank you so much for bringing tremendous insight into this horryific situation. Please never stop being a voice of reason, both with your in-depth analysis of history and context, as well as posts like these.
Thank you as always, Darryl, for making sure that none of us can become too comfortable in our online silos. We don't get off the hook so easily - the world is an infinitely complex place, and humans can always surprise if given the chance.
One question nags at me, though. You say in this podcast (and many others besides) that (to paraphrase) most Palestinians are just like us, that they want the same sorts of mundane creature comforts and safety that we all do. And yet, I remember in that episode on immigration with those Twitter anons you expressed a good deal of trepidation about the influx of undocumented immigrants into the US because of the effects it does/will have on American society. But (to construct a partial syllogism), if most Palestinians are "just like us," then it's not far-fetched to imagine that most of the undocumented people coming here are "just like us" as well. If that's the case, then why be concerned with their entry into the US? After all, it would be hard to argue that we don't need our population replenished (as a means of providing a tax base to support our aging population, among other reasons), and if anything people from Central/South America share more in common with Americans than Palestinians do (given that our country has a huge Latino population). If you don't agree, and think that there are essential differences among these three exemplar groups, then what is it that separates them, and what would make either of those two groups - broadly, people from Central/South America (a huge oversimplification, I know) vs. Palestinians - different from Americans such that their entry into the country (legal or otherwise) would make things worse here? Is it merely a differential equation (e.g. rate of influx and assimilative force) - can anyone become an American if 'prepared' the right way? I don't have great answers to these questions myself but they seem pertinent to our understanding of what America is at the very least.
I’ve traveled and worked in Latin America and in Israel as well as other countries.
I have a similar opinion on the current conflict, and really all conflicts. These are human beings with a small subset of them causing immense pain and suffering on the majority.
Every person I’ve shared a meal with and got to know around the world aspires to keep their families safe and fed. To have opportunity. We are all the same.
But... A country is not a country without a secure border. Do I blame people for wanting to come to our country? Absolutely not. We live in the greatest country in the world (in my opinion). However, knowing that at least 80% of the world lives well below our standard of living, should we allow everyone in that wants “opportunity”? Sadly, we would all end up living just like the places they left.
If you want to see a working example of this spend some time in Miami. There was such an influx of people seeking opportunity that they did not feel the need to assimilate. They still speak their native language and they brought with them the same corrupt business and political practices that they left behind.
Personally, I’m not too excited about the Miami model going nationwide.
People at their most basic wants are all incredibly similar. But the cultures they are bathed and raised into are vastly different and so if a country wants to remain cohesive then everyone needs to agree and assimilate to the same basic governance concepts. With unconstrained immigration and no efforts or desire to assimilate to the new place, eventually elements of the culture one chose to leave will resurface and stress the seams.
I’m having a real hard time as a father and struggling working American man with this whole thing. I keep going back and forth with my sympathies. I wind up being simultaneously anti-Muslim and pro Palestine. Frankly I really wish Americans weren’t involved with any of this at all.
I grew up in the vein that would have had me wearing an American flag cape while waving an Israeli flag cape at one of these rallies. Now thanks to Fear and Loathing as the rock that knocked me off the fence, I equally am repulsed and feel tragic sorrow for both sides.
I hope she checks back in after a few months. It’s horrifying what Israel feels it must do. I actually understand it in a cold realist sort of way, but this onslaught won’t be sustainable and I think they will have a very difficult future with waning European and American support.
I keep thinking about what you said in episode two of fear and loathing, that for the political Zionist, anti-Semitism was/is a fundamental component of their identity. Like, the early Zionists didn’t try to correct misguided assumptions about how subversive and widespread Jewish power secretly was, they used that false generalization to their advantage, which in this case was getting British officials to fear them and get behind their intentions for Palestine.
Now I’m looking at headlines, from, for instance, the free press, that read “What Happens When There Aren’t Enough Jews to Lynch” and I wonder if this isn’t part of some unwitting self-fulfilling prophesy that originally served their political opportunism but which now has manifested itself in a very real devastating way. Like, does it really serve a people to continue to buy into and then turn around and sell their role as victim? No doubt the Jews have suffered real and insane hardships for thousands of years, but to make it one of the primary markers of their identity really feels like a move backward, into a corner. You know? That was what early political Zionism was seizing upon — we have to drive home that downtrodden identity even further, make ourselves out to be the ultimate victims, which, even if they were, provided them with ZERO justification at all to then participate in power-over, oppressive tactics, which they very clearly did in the creation of modern Israel. The point is they were not realizing the repeated biblical call to turn and remain oriented to the light of God, when time after time it is shown how an orientation away from God manifests only in self destruction. Does any of that make sense? Really curious what you think about this.
Here's the text of the email (with a few typos cleaned up by me):
"Hey! :D
I hope this e-mail finds you well. Apologies in advance for the English. I am not a native speaker. Originally from Gaza. Im (name).. 20 years old. I was able to secure the necessary permits to move to the west bank about 2 years ago to stay with my aunt and uncle while i conduct my studies. i hope to be a nurse (hebron).
I found your tweets a while ago and have followed you on twitter a while. I listened to your podcast series for weeks. Some of it i knew, some of it i didn't. It was nice to hear an non-biased non-arab (presumably not jewish) narrate the history of my people. At the start of episode 2 i realised they are just like me. The jews, I mean. They wanted their own land and came with hopes and dreams to secure a better future for their loved ones and families. I think there is probably a jewish girl my age wanting peace with us.
I know your media views us as vermin, but we aren't. One of the reasons i follow you is not just your podcast but you see us as humans which is so rare for people in america.
I don't believe israelis are bad or that jewish people are bad. I know in gaza there are many that do, but it is sometimes hard to escape that after what they have done. My family still lives in a cage.
The blockcade has destroyed the economy! Sometimes ten hours without electricity! Israel has a thriving economy. Tech centre of the middle east. We don't even have our own airport. We don't have good infrastructure. We haven't been able to rebuild. We have nothing. Even in the west bank they terorrirse us all the time. It makes people angry and resentful.
But there are many like me and my friend Fatimah, who even prayed for the Israelis when the attacks happened on the 7th. I pray Allah grants them Jannah. Those people at the concert did not choose this life any more than i did. My heart is sad for their families, what was done to them cannot be forgiven ever :( and allah won't forgive those that did it.
My own parents and siblings are in Gaza. Every day i hear from them i thank allah they are alive. He is merciful for sparing them. They would rather die then leave gaza and never be able to go back. When the bombs came near my home in 2019 i did not care. I was ready. I did not cower. When you grow up in Gaza you prepare for death. My heart is so broken for my people, i do not have enough tears left. Everyday new buildings. My old school destroyed. My uncles shop in Gaza in ruins.
One of the reason i adored your podcast and listened to it twice was you make us sound so similar. By us i mean us palestinians and the jewish. We are just both brothers/sisters, jewish and arab who want the same thing. A place to call home. They were just like me. The difference is when they die your media mourns them in a way it never mourns us. In 2018 so many of us died and yet nobody mourns us and humanises us in death. They have articles for lone IDF soldiers who die in israel. But when our boys die in the west bank, nothing is said..Just those dumb arabs that deserve it.
We did not get a say in how Gaza was run. I would not vote for them! My dad in fact hates them he calls the hamas leaderships corrupt baboons. He knew young boys who he teaches who join the resistance and he feels so sad for them. Sad because they were sweet innocent boys who saw their families killed by the israelis and then are driven to go fight for a group that does not care for them.
My friend Rakeem i played with when i was younger. He saw both of his parents die from the israelis. He also saw his grandparents, one sister and baby brother aged 2 die. Only him and his sister lived. He carried his little brothers corpse for hours when the bombs came to Gaza. He was only 11. Those are the boys that become angry and vengeful and rather than nurture the anger to do something good hamas exploits it.
My dad always say hamas do not care for the lives of these boys and that those boys could have done something great had they been given a chance to, but instead they will die fighting for leaders who do not care!!!! Good boys who are now bad men and ruined. But what can we do ? Fight with our bare hands against guns? Just as silly as to think we can fight off israeli bombs with our hands.
And once the resistance is gone i don't see we will have peace! I cannot see the occupation ending ... What's next for Gaza? i do not even blame IDF soldiers, they are just as brainwashed as hamas to do their job. i blame the israeli government for making them treat us this way!!! Their governemnt is viciously evil! Towns, shops , home in gaza destroyed, they don't even allow in building materials. So many dead in gaza. The survellience in the west bank is now worse than before! Settlers are legally allowed to carry guns to shoot at us! But if we fight back where will be our right to defend against the settlers? Children are trauamtized.
The material conditions for palestinians won't improve. And through the ashes hamas' ideas will be martyred and then it will change a whole group of young innocent kids who will become even more vengeful after seeing their families killed. You cannot bomb your way to changing hamas' ideas. Only improvement in our current state will see us change and make sure the childen of Palestine understand that the jews also care for them. Education is a must, then the Palestinians children will grow up caring for the Jewish. Otherwise if they are forced into the cage again then you will see something new emerge in a decades' time, and a new group will commit something much worse than the events of October 7th.
If you ever choose to come to Falastin, my university would love to welcome you. We have had a few Americans visit that are sympathetic to us and like understanding our side of the conflict and how we can make peace and get a proper state! We are very gracious hosts!!! I shared your podcast with my two friends, i hope they will listen. They promised me they would but it is extremely long so may take them time to get through. My uncle Abdal is listening. He is 15 minutes through episode 1. He is such a kind gentleman who wants to make peace with the jewish folk, even though he knows they think of us badly more than ever now. He was sad when Rabin died. He said Rabin was good. He hates bibi.
Some of the comments i see on your page make me sad. I want to comment then stop myself because as to not invite hate. (Also i run a harry styles fan account on twitter so i think i would just draw to much attention haha) But i wish people could see that we too are human beings with simple dreams. Mine is to go to a Harry Styles or Kehlani concert. And to get to 100k tiktok followers. To visit my amazing internet friends in Europe who i met on twitter. For the Americans to see us as human beings also, the way they see Israelis as humans. We aren't that different from the Americans, we just have a different flag. I also want my country to become liberated, to end our occupation and to restore the dignitiy of my people. i want a peaceful government. i do not want the jewish to die anymore then i want my own to die. I do not want to see buildings and homes and stores in my city turned into nothing. I don't want to be sad everytime my family calls because i am so anxious thinking someone has died. The situation at home is so bad :( And i don't know why some Americans seem to like seeing us suffer.
I wrote a lot here... But once again as a girl from Falastin thank you for telling our story. Thank you for telling their story too and how our tales overlap in a way that not many can appreciate. May you have great prosperity and happiness.
Well wishes
(name)"
I’ve been with you since around the time the Fear and Loathing series dropped and have been hooked since. You always put out quality stuff but your commitment to your Christian faith of seeing the dignity in the individual and fighting the urge to turn them into abstractions is truly remarkable and so needed in this context. You are doing inspirational modeling by challenging your audience to resist the temptation to take the easy way out by painting one side as monsters. Keep it up. You are doing God’s work and forcing me to do some serious soul searching.
You did a great job of saying that for me.
This letter gave me chills. I don’t believe I’m being hyperbolic when I say that your series on the conflict is one of the most important podcast series ever recorded.
I’ve recommended your Fear and Loathing podcast to peers and every person, literally every one, came away less polarized and more empathetic to the Israelis and Palestinians, just wishing for peace. It’s been a spell breaker for people, and I mean that in the most human of ways.
Whenever people think there’s not a way out and conflict is necessary, it’s a good reminder that there’s always a way to more humanity, it just needs better leaders and messaging for it to occur. We’re all unique people with unique motives, desires, and dreams, which can be empathized and reasoned with.
And we shouldn’t forget that, even when bombed out Palestinians or beheaded Israelis fill us with absolute rage.
I could not have cared less for Palestine until I listened to fear and loathing. Hated everything about the podcast but ended up listening to it at least three times. It’s tough to realize everything you thought you knew about something isn’t true. That series has brought a big number of people to have a lot more empathy for all the people suffering in that region.
Listened to "Administration of Violence" during my worst night having Covid -- so horrifying it made me cowboy it up.
Bro my measurements for toughness is like hours worked or how light of clothes I can wear when it’s cold. Some of these episodes make me feel like a total American dough boy
Same.
spot on observation
Mr. Cooper- I've listened & subscribed for a long time, and I'm very appreciative for all of the work that you've shared. It's enriched my life a great deal. This is the first time I've commented or engaged. While my deepest sympathies (as a free and unfuckingstoppable woman, with many lgbt people and Jews and other assorted haram types in my closest personal circle) will always lie with the democratic West and it's imperfectly executed but ultimately superior ethical framework, I have been grateful for the nuance and provocation to deeper thinking that your own worldview has provided. I was touched by this girl's note. It is a good object lesson in the ways that we all essentialize each other. She spoke about "Americans" in the same way that she seems to think that all Americans talk about "Palestinians", as if we are a monolith. It's human nature. I'm sure people on the internet are engaging in all kinds of Neanderthal rhetoric around this nightmare, on all sides. In the vein of "most people are basically decent", I have to believe that the vast majority of people around the world understand that Hamas doesn't represent all Palestinians. However, the horrible truth is that until the many Palestinian people of good heart and good faith decide to rise up, and reject with force and conviction the monstrous ideology that has grown up within their community, they will never be free. The outside world cannot free Palestinians (or Muslims more broadly) from the darkest tendencies that exist in their group, any more than any outside force could save America from the moral crime of slavery. We had to fight nearly to our national death to become righteous, and we are fighting still. The Palestinians will have to fight themselves for liberation, before Israel or any other power can set them free. If they do, they will find that they have more allies in their fight against external oppression than they can even imagine. I believe the Israelis would be first among their allies, in fact.
I would like your young letter writer to know: how many of us pray every day that the decent people in her world will gain the upper hand against the terrorists and the merchants of hatred. We know you are there, and we know that you are the first, and most numerous, and most tragic victims of Hamas/ISIS/Taliban/Hezbollah etc. All decent people are weeping for you, and are yearning for you to be free, so that you may put your desperately needed shoulders to the wheel beside us, as we continue to strive towards the ideal of universal human freedom. Godspeed.
The slave states of the United States were stopped by an outside force. The people of the slave society did not rise up and overthrow the slave owners. The change did not come from within. The slave south refused to do what outsiders told it to and then the outsiders forced their states to change.
If the northern states had imposed a regime as cruel as Israel’s on the south, you can bet that vicious guerrilla fighting would have continued for decades until the cycle of reciprocal atrocity tore the country back into two. White southerners railed against the occupation of the north as unjust and oppressive, but ultimately the north’s policy it forced on the rebellious states has nothing of the brutal dehumanization that Palestine has experienced. The extremist resistance movements of the south such as the ku klux klan were suppressed with targeted anti-insurgency campaigns. Not with indiscriminate massacre. Because while the north was an outside power imposing its moral will on the south, it did not dehumanize southerners or treat them like animals.
All of that is to say, your analogy to the US Civil War is completely inappropriate, because the population that practiced slavery did not rise up and overthrow the institution. The north did not rise up against its own leaders. The south seceded and formed another country whose leadership was overthrown from above and then the occupiers proceeded to rebuild the society they had invaded.
To be somewhat fair I think that after Sherman and Reconstruction the people of places like Atlanta might disagree that what they faced was less dehumanizing than what Israel is doing to Palestine. Israel has done some rotten things but they haven’t gone scorched earth. Yet.
I take your points, and thank you for them. However, your story about the American Civil War, while consisting of statements that are not facially false, doesn't exactly qualify as a definitive description of what I think most people could agree was a fairly complex period in history. We could do point/counterpoint forever, I suppose- I could bring up Southern Unionists and the fact that the north bothered to fight at all, you could bring up the northern need for southern raw materials and the cynicism of politicians...but it's already a bit boring, no? Tedious legalistic arguments aside, I hope you agree at least a little with my heartfelt well-wishes for the blameless souls whose wicked lot in life it is to be the victims of history, which was really the only point I cared about making.
Well said. I kind of had tunnel vision there for a minute and got fixated on the point, for some reason. (I might be a little sleep deprived today.) Anyway, I share your sentiment for the people involved and I wish you a good night or day wherever you are
Bless you, Ethan. Good night from Yonkers, NY 😆
Thank you for sharing this, it’s hard for me to hear these stories and not want to put on my tin foil hat and think that maybe war is the goal in and of itself. The military industrial complex cannot self sustain without these ongoing conflicts. They seem to be almost inevitable as long as the people in power are controlled by the money that is to be profited from war. We talk a big game about peace and democracy in the US but looking at our actions it really seems to me that we are a country addicted to war and always looking for a fight. It makes me very sad that so many people suffer globally because of our brainwashed population and a handful of greedy elites controlling the purse strings.
The changes that were made to the American economy so it could become the "Armory of Democracy" also locked it into that role. The US has been riding a bubble since 1945; if the wars dry up, the whole ponzi scheme falls apart.
Darryl, there's a strange phenomenon. A kind of conflation I've been seeing a lot. My pro-Israel Jewish friends are very aware that Israel withdrew from Gaza in 2005. But, listening to you (and many other American commenters) it would be really easy to think that Gaza has been militarily occupied for decades, just like the West Bank. Gaza is blockaded, but that's a different thing from occupation.
This episode is a great example of this kind of conflation. There was a terrorist attack launched from Gaza, followed by Israeli bombardment of Gaza and now invasion of Gaza, and in order to help us understand the context of these events, you convey to us ... stories about the military occupation of the West Bank and a letter from a resident of the West Bank. It makes me feel like you're trying to pull a fast one. All these stories about checkpoints and stun grenades ... that's not happening in Gaza, because the Israelis withdrew from Gaza.
I think a lot of Americans genuinely don't know about the Israeli withdrawal from Gaza in 2005, because commenters like you don't talk about it. But that has to be an important part of the story here, right? You can't explain why these attacks were launched from Gaza (rather than the West Bank, or somewhere else) without that piece of the puzzle.
And it's a very important piece of why my pro-Israel Jewish friends think about the situation the way they do. For them, blockading Gaza instead of occupying it was a test run of the two state solution. Can they live in peace with the Palestinians without directly occupying and oppressing them? Can "good fences make good neighbors"? Very sadly, that question seems to have been answered.
I strongly approve of your efforts to humanize both sides. Good job! But I also want to rely on you for relevant historical context. What gives? Or am I being tricked by Israeli propaganda?
The Israelis withdrew their personnel, but then just placed the city under siege. They control the airspace, they control how far out to sea Gazan fishing boats are allowed to go, they control the movement of people in/out of Gaza, and they control whether and how much food, medicine, rebuilding supplies, and other resources are allowed in. The whole place is surrounded by a wall patrolled by remotely-controlled robotic machine guns. Indeed, given the change in tactics toward Gaza after the withdrawal - away from counter-insurgency, targeted assassinations, etc to full-blown military assaults - it's pretty clear that the decision was made by Israel to pull their people out to give them a freer hand when "mowing the lawn."
Wait, is it really true that Israel controls the movement of people and goods in and out of Gaza? I was just reading this Wikipedia article about the Rafah Crossing (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rafah_Border_Crossing) and it makes it seem like it's mostly Egypt in charge of Rafah.
"On 3 February 2008, the border was closed again by Egypt"
"on 29 April, Egypt announced that the border crossing would be opened on a permanent basis."
"On 22 January 2015, Egypt closed the border crossing."
"In May 2018, Egyptian authorities opened the crossing"
"In February 2021, Egypt opened the crossing "indefinitely" for the first time in years"
As for supplies, the Wikipedia "Gaza imports" article (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza_imports) says: "The Rafah Border Crossing is the sole crossing point between Egypt and the Gaza Strip. It has been closed for the transfer of commercial goods since 2007, and Egypt maintained that it would only open the crossing if forces from the Palestinian Authority presidential guard and a European supervisory force returned to guard the border crossing."
I don't want to argue just to argue; the Rafah Crossing and the involvement of Egypt is important, because it's a significant difference between military occupation and blockade. If Gaza was genuinely militarily occupied by Israel, Egypt wouldn't matter -- Israel could just set up a checkpoint in front of Rafah. But under blockade, Gaza has a significant degree of freedom that it wouldn't have under occupation: they can go to Egypt, if Egypt will let them.
And the Egypt border situation is a big plank in the pro-Israel side's arguments: You can tell that the problem is with Hamas, not Israel, they say, because Egypt has the same problems with Hamas as Israel does.
I know Wikipedia can be biased, and I didn't check its sources. Do I have false facts? Or is there more context I need to really understand it? Like, is Egypt secretly an Israeli puppet?
This is mendacious nonsense. The restrictions on sovereignty are either (a) perfectly reasonable measures to stop Gaza being used as a base to attack Israelis (which clearly didn't go far enough) and (b) measures taken after Gazans overwhelmingly elected Hamas* and Hamas attacked Israel. 'Mowing the lawn' is a concept invented afterwards when the military reported back that Hamas was too well dug in to re-occupy the Gaza strip without massive casualties. It's basically a fancy word for Cope.
In 2005, Gaza benefitted from massive international aid, and, even more importantly, massive international good will. It's not an exaggeration to say that had they decided to set up an international tax haven they would have been allowed to go ahead with it. What they actually did is celebrate their victory over Israel and start pressing ahead for more victories. Sure, not everyone felt this way, and no doubt many 17 year old girls would have preferred to focus on Harry Styles, but that it was Palestinians collectively chose.
What this shows is that the 2 State Solution is a complete non starter. Whatever deal is made, there will be some conditions attached to it that mean ackshully Palestinians are under occupation, Palestinians will attack because this is all they actually want to do, and deep thinkers will justify it. Every single step towards the 2 State Solution has made everything worse, for Israelis, for Palestinians, for everyone.
*While overall the 2006 elections were close, Hamas won a massive victory in Gaza itself hence their subsequent takeover.
I don’t that I’d say 56% is a massive victory and hardly means they speak for everyone.
If Trump got 56% everyone would say this was a massive victory. What is the pertinence of saying Hamas do not speak for everyone (something that is probably true of any regime anywhere, ever)?
Note that there was an alternative:
"Also known as the National Coalition for Justice and Democracy, the Wa'ad list was headed by Gazan Eyad El-Sarraj, who was a consultant to the Palestinian delegation to the Camp David 2000 Summit and heads a group of Palestinian and Israeli academics working towards a peace agreement.[17] The list's main platform is security reforms, establishing the rule of law and respect for human rights."
Guess how many seats they got? (It rhymes with 'hero').
You're right, people might say that, but is it true? No, 56% is not a massive victory. 56% is almost literally if you and 9 and of your friends voted and 6 of you wanted something and 4 of you didn't (I say almost because the situation I describe is actually a larger margin of victory than 56% but I digress). Is that massive? Hardly. Just like you probably don't want someone throwing you in an identity or ideological group that you aren't part of or don't like so those 44% probably don't either. Maybe they should be speaking up louder maybe a lot of things, but also maybe they are scared and persecuted and don't want to be killed in the crossfire...the at least 5% of Palestinian Christians that make up the Gazan population I'd be willing to bet don't.
The pertinence is to remind people that Hamas is not everyone and so to simply speak in terms that removes the humanity of the innocent people on the other side simply because they live mixed within that side is a dangerous path to head down so that we do not slowly turn into the evil we are seeking to be rid of.
To be clear, in response to whatever you are assuming, my belief is that civilians should never be targeted in war, even if they are provably Nazi paedophile space aliens. The purpose of the rules of law are to limit and contain conflict, not to administrate abstract justice.
Now, as regards the public opinion of people in Gaza. First, what you probably haven't even considered is that some people who did not vote for Hamas are just as or *more* extreme. The PFLP, which quite recently entered a synagogue in West Jerusalem and massacred the people there, gouging out their eyes, also did quite well. Further, many Fatah supporters are also rejectionists, but they don't support Hamas because they are not into strict Islam. Again, Gaza has a peace party. It got no seats, because peace is not a popular policy in Gaza; war is.
I appreciate the response! So you would say that it's a de facto military occupation, basically. The seeming difference between the West Bank and Gaza is actually a propaganda smokescreen, which the Israel apologists have failed to see through. And the Israelis didn't really make any kind of concession or sacrifice when they "withdrew", it was just a different strategy for the same oppression.
I had been under the impression that Hamas was able to flourish in Gaza only because of Israel taking a genuine hands-off stance. If it was really so locked down, how could such a violently anti-Israel group become the government?
"If it was really so locked down, how could such a violently anti-Israel group become the government?"
Because it isn't and people who say so are just liars. Not everything is all that complicated.
It’s my understanding that Hamas much like bin Laden received a fair amount of support from governments that would later come to regret that support under the premise that the enemy of my enemy is my friend. On top of that there are always people who are willing to profit off conflict.
Think about it for a minute. The US government just sent a pile of US taxpayer dollars and weapons constructed with US taxpayer dollars to Israel to fight Hamas. Hamas is using, at least in part, weapons paid for by the U.S. taxpayer and abandoned in Afghanistan. The US also sent a pile of US taxpayer dollars to help humanitarian efforts in Gaza, a substantial chunk of which will undoubtedly wind up in the control of Hamas since they hold the power in Gaza. So the US taxpayer is paying for both sides of the conflict. Meanwhile those in the US government do everything possible to pay the least amount of tax possible and also own a pile of defense contracting stocks that are doing very well right now. So the US taxpayer foots the bill for both sides of a war that has little to nothing to do with us and our political elite get rich on war profiteering. Then they raise our taxes to pay for their war. I highly doubt the American government is any sort of special sort of evil and suspect this is more the norm for how the world’s governments operate. I suspect there are plenty of people in the Israeli government who will benefit from instability and lose power or control if peace is ever established. That is why Hamas was allowed to come into and maintain power.
Israel did pull out of Gaza and Darryl has talked about that. He also mentioned in those letters that those incidents took place in the West Bank.
Walling off Gaza “contained” the problem until it didn’t. Certainly no one really thinks that confining people into a ghetto or open air prison indefinitely would result in them feeling that they have a good quality of life. Nor would it result in them slowly gaining an understanding and empathy for the people keeping them walled in.
I live in a nice neighborhood that is very pleasant. I have all the things I need and I like it here. If you built a wall around it, restricted my movement, my food, my access to medical care, my electricity etc. I think you would find out pretty quickly that my nice neighborhood is no longer filled with pleasant people.
Thank you for sharing this!
Hey Darryl, I must confess that after 2 years subscribing I made the decision a few weeks ago to end my subscription. It was a combination of finances and the recent content hadn’t been as interesting to me as what has come before. However, since October 7 I have been extremely impressed with your views on the Israel-Palestine issue. I simply cannot imagine missing what is to come. I got an email today saying that my subscription was ending tomorrow and I have gladly renewed. All the best.
Shoot me an email and I'll get you set up with a comp'd subscription.
That’s very generous of you, but no need thank you. I insist on paying and I’m happy to. It’s well worth it and what you are trying to do is absolutely worth it
she could have been a jew talking about the boys who joined the irgun.
i, a jew. have also lived inside islam. i don't mean inside a muslim country--i mean inside islam. the religions are identical. the good parts are identical. the crazy is identical. the language of mercy and the language of revilement are identical.
and for any believer of either faith, there will always be a floor to their mercy, if they truly take as god's word the dogma of their religion.
i was once friendly with a pakistani family who were educated urbane people. they'd lived for awhile in australia while the father completed an advanced degree. they had lots of foreign friends.
one day i was out walking with the two elder daughters who were a little younger than i. we were together almost every day; they lived across the street from the people i was staying with. they spoke perfect english. and that day, the older girl said to me--and she was almost 20 years old and was studying pre-med--that she really shouldn't be friends with me because i was a jew and the quran told her that was a bad thing to do.
she did keep being friendly with me. but who likes receiving a sort of convenient special dispensation?
all cults are bad. a jewish claim to the region of our ethnic origin is perfectly legitimate and valid based on historical and archaeological and genetic realities. bolstering that with religious bullshit is bad.
just as claiming that the arabs now calling themselves palestinians are not originally colonizers and the fruit of conquering waves throughout history is untruthful.
this can't be fixed while adherents of three cults keep bringing myths into a historical and political minefield.
As someone born and raised in a Western country, but with family in the West Bank, thank you so much for bringing tremendous insight into this horryific situation. Please never stop being a voice of reason, both with your in-depth analysis of history and context, as well as posts like these.
Thank you as always, Darryl, for making sure that none of us can become too comfortable in our online silos. We don't get off the hook so easily - the world is an infinitely complex place, and humans can always surprise if given the chance.
One question nags at me, though. You say in this podcast (and many others besides) that (to paraphrase) most Palestinians are just like us, that they want the same sorts of mundane creature comforts and safety that we all do. And yet, I remember in that episode on immigration with those Twitter anons you expressed a good deal of trepidation about the influx of undocumented immigrants into the US because of the effects it does/will have on American society. But (to construct a partial syllogism), if most Palestinians are "just like us," then it's not far-fetched to imagine that most of the undocumented people coming here are "just like us" as well. If that's the case, then why be concerned with their entry into the US? After all, it would be hard to argue that we don't need our population replenished (as a means of providing a tax base to support our aging population, among other reasons), and if anything people from Central/South America share more in common with Americans than Palestinians do (given that our country has a huge Latino population). If you don't agree, and think that there are essential differences among these three exemplar groups, then what is it that separates them, and what would make either of those two groups - broadly, people from Central/South America (a huge oversimplification, I know) vs. Palestinians - different from Americans such that their entry into the country (legal or otherwise) would make things worse here? Is it merely a differential equation (e.g. rate of influx and assimilative force) - can anyone become an American if 'prepared' the right way? I don't have great answers to these questions myself but they seem pertinent to our understanding of what America is at the very least.
I’ve traveled and worked in Latin America and in Israel as well as other countries.
I have a similar opinion on the current conflict, and really all conflicts. These are human beings with a small subset of them causing immense pain and suffering on the majority.
Every person I’ve shared a meal with and got to know around the world aspires to keep their families safe and fed. To have opportunity. We are all the same.
But... A country is not a country without a secure border. Do I blame people for wanting to come to our country? Absolutely not. We live in the greatest country in the world (in my opinion). However, knowing that at least 80% of the world lives well below our standard of living, should we allow everyone in that wants “opportunity”? Sadly, we would all end up living just like the places they left.
If you want to see a working example of this spend some time in Miami. There was such an influx of people seeking opportunity that they did not feel the need to assimilate. They still speak their native language and they brought with them the same corrupt business and political practices that they left behind.
Personally, I’m not too excited about the Miami model going nationwide.
People at their most basic wants are all incredibly similar. But the cultures they are bathed and raised into are vastly different and so if a country wants to remain cohesive then everyone needs to agree and assimilate to the same basic governance concepts. With unconstrained immigration and no efforts or desire to assimilate to the new place, eventually elements of the culture one chose to leave will resurface and stress the seams.
I’m having a real hard time as a father and struggling working American man with this whole thing. I keep going back and forth with my sympathies. I wind up being simultaneously anti-Muslim and pro Palestine. Frankly I really wish Americans weren’t involved with any of this at all.
I grew up in the vein that would have had me wearing an American flag cape while waving an Israeli flag cape at one of these rallies. Now thanks to Fear and Loathing as the rock that knocked me off the fence, I equally am repulsed and feel tragic sorrow for both sides.
I feel this comment in my bones. I’m in the same boat
Daryl, you have done a phenomenal job here. Keep it up!
I hope she checks back in after a few months. It’s horrifying what Israel feels it must do. I actually understand it in a cold realist sort of way, but this onslaught won’t be sustainable and I think they will have a very difficult future with waning European and American support.
Darryl, this is a really helpful piece. I am sure that "be on the side of the innocent" is the best and maybe the most righteous thing. Thanks.
I keep thinking about what you said in episode two of fear and loathing, that for the political Zionist, anti-Semitism was/is a fundamental component of their identity. Like, the early Zionists didn’t try to correct misguided assumptions about how subversive and widespread Jewish power secretly was, they used that false generalization to their advantage, which in this case was getting British officials to fear them and get behind their intentions for Palestine.
Now I’m looking at headlines, from, for instance, the free press, that read “What Happens When There Aren’t Enough Jews to Lynch” and I wonder if this isn’t part of some unwitting self-fulfilling prophesy that originally served their political opportunism but which now has manifested itself in a very real devastating way. Like, does it really serve a people to continue to buy into and then turn around and sell their role as victim? No doubt the Jews have suffered real and insane hardships for thousands of years, but to make it one of the primary markers of their identity really feels like a move backward, into a corner. You know? That was what early political Zionism was seizing upon — we have to drive home that downtrodden identity even further, make ourselves out to be the ultimate victims, which, even if they were, provided them with ZERO justification at all to then participate in power-over, oppressive tactics, which they very clearly did in the creation of modern Israel. The point is they were not realizing the repeated biblical call to turn and remain oriented to the light of God, when time after time it is shown how an orientation away from God manifests only in self destruction. Does any of that make sense? Really curious what you think about this.